You are not logged in (log in or sign up)
RPG Laboratory

FREAKS! (May be renamed Vices and Virtues) The beginnings of something very bad.

So, today, I was doodling in my notebook a few character concepts for fun. Recently, I've been wanting to do lots of DnD style monsters, but as likable characters, you know? Sort of a Phil Foglio type thing. So first I did a cute little goblin girl,a sorceress I guess. Then I started to experiment and do weirder stuff. The crowning glory was an Ilithid done in a Jimmy Buffet style flower shirt, but with that huge v neck collar all Ilithid clothes have. I got a good laugh at it, then thought to myself, "Gee, it would be great to play this cat in a game."
I've always enjoyed playing DnD monsters in DnD games, you see, and though I understand why the world of dungeons and dragons is filled with hundreds of nasty intelligent races and only a few with the potential for good, it doesn't mean I have to like it. I mean, all peoples have demons they have to confront, it doesn't make them particularly evil. It just makes them, if not humanoid, real. Just because trolls are brutish and ilithids are megalomaniacs and goblins are weakwilled bullies, that doesn't mean they have to be. What if there was say, a nature loving troll, eh? Maybe a laid back ilithid who just wants to research his work and surf a bit, right? Or heck, maybe a young rebel goblin who wants to go against everything her race is made out to be. These people, of course, are considered by both the race that spawned them and the lucky "good" races as not fitting into the natural order of things. In other words, freaks.
This is sort of the basis behind the game I've decided to go forward with, entitled "FREAKS!". The idea is that it's about the monsters of a standard fantasy world, but on an individual level. Each of them is blessed with special abilities that makes them unique and powerful in their own right, but also a terrible vice that makes them "monsters". The characters are adventurers of course, since thats where the people who don't function within the system of Medevial fantasy end up in. Heres my first ideas on how the system works.

-Four generic traits- Mind, Body, Coordination, Soul. These are pools of points. You get to choose one that's your star trait, which you get extra skills in.
-Next, you choose your skills. Each skill is built using trees of abilities, which are bought with points in that skill's trait.
Finally, you choose your Vice. The vice is the attitude or manner or whatever that makes your race a "monster". For goblins, it's cowardly opprotunism. For ilithids, it's insatiable power hunger. See how it works? Anytime you do something that's connected to your vice, you gain points in your vice. There are two things connected to this. First, your vice works in the same way as any of the other traits. You're able to put skills in it, and you can spend vice points to use skills specific to your race, like an orc going into a savage rage or a goblin torturing a prisoner with great precision. The flipside to this is the more you use your vice, the more the vice controls you. Each time you tap into your vice's powers, the DM can roll to see if the vice takes over, and the GM gains control over you. Should this happen, you can roll to see if you can control yourself again, but this costs a lot, and the price gets steeper the more you use your vice. There comes a point where you've allowed your base urges to consume you and you become what everyone thinks you to be, a monster.
There is another side to it. All beings have virtue, and by focusing and distilling that which is virtuous within you, you can turn away from the path of your vice. Virtue is a trait that is used to both buy off ranks in your vice, but to also gain new levels. By practicing virtue, you grow as a person. By practicing vice, you grow into a monster. I'm going to post more systemy stuff later on, but this should do for now. Please comment, tell me what you like so far.

This is sort of what was

This is sort of what was pointed out in another post, about resource-management games, as a balancing mechanism; akin to that in cyberpunk games where characters who load up on cyberware enhancements (to improve dice throws in combat resolution) may "lose their humanity." I've always been a fan of the "monsters" in rpgs having as involved a personal life as the "good guys: both abstracts such as goals and adherence to the physical and social structures of the game's background world, and game mechanics such as statistics and skills and such. Ken St. Andre was the first published game designer I know to do this, in his "Monsters! Monsters!" spin-off of his "Tunnels & Trolls" rpg (one of the first, if not the first, commercially published - and certainly the first successful - rpg inspired by "D&D"). Your idea, of forcing the characters to adhere to a moral code - similar to the "cyberpunk loss of humanity" - is excellent. The one quibble I'd have though is you're putting a humanocentric viewpoint on "what makes a monster?" For almost any human society "cowardly opportunism" or "insatiable power hunger" are practiced to fine arts but not officially virtues (well, unless you're running for president). But in a properly constituted goblin society, might not what we consider vices be considered excellent virtues? I gather though that the point of your proposed game is that the player-character monster specifically wants to get along in the human society, "stop to smell the flowers & can't we all just get along," and so is striving to practice human rather than goblin virtues, and the game is about having him avoid the latter when he will get better dice rolls to accomplish other goals (E.g. you get experience points for acquiring treasure and the best way to acquire treasure is some sort of cowardly opportunism). Problem I see with that is the player knows what he wants the character to do and will deliberately avoid fulfilling short-term goals for the character in favor of not practicing monster-virtues/human-vices.

Weeelll, not so much no. Can

Weeelll, not so much no. Can you honestly say that humanity as a whole is all about smelling flowers and getting along? We too, have vice, and we too can be monsters. The way that it works is that the game itself works in a form of laid back moral absolutism. There's an obvious good or bad, and all sapients can be on one side of the spectrum or the other, but the actual definition isn't hard and fast. For instance, the vice for humans could be say, "corruption". This makes sense, we humans have a tendency to twist what could be good intentions into terrible constructs. Corruption gives us certain power, but also makes us lose control of ourselves until we become slaves to that vice. When that happens, that human becomes a monster, governed by our most base trait. Now almost all humans are corrupt to a certain extent, so we're not monsters to ourselves. Goblins don't consider themselves monsters either, see?

The game is all about going against that which makes you a monster, now matter what you are. It's about striving to be something greater than what you are. Now mind you, I don't intend the characters to play goody goody monsters, all about being nice to everyone. This game is intended to put pressure on them to use their vice and I want my players to sweat. Being a person also means being flawed, you know?

Humanity as a whole is not

Humanity as a whole is not about "smelling flowers and getting along." These are idealized virtues, honored "more in the breach than in the observance." Nevertheless we as humans claim they are virtues, and in a game such as you suggest the characters with a humancentric viewpoint would be rewarded for not giving in to the urge to trample flowers and be hostile to others. But you have to come up with some tangible (in game terms) reward in the long-term that exceeds the short-term rewards (my character gets loot) of trampling and betraying. In an rpg, virtue is NOT its own reward. Yes, humans officially consider "corruption" to be a vice (although in many cultures it is/has been taken for granted, it is neither vice nor virtue but simply government; at most times in most places every bureaucrat did and had to supplement any pay by receiving "gifts"), and we would become "monsters" if continually corrupt. But, especially in the pseudo-historical/fantasy literature pastiche of most rpgs, not only will many characters be corrupt as a matter of course there is every good reason to be (character gets loot) and no reason not to be ("I'll be a good person? Says who?").

Becomes even more problematic with other sentient species. Goblins might not consider themselves monsters, but that presupposes: a coherent, rational society that can survive using very different social mores; that society isn't a fringe element or small subculture within a larger human society (as so many rpgs tacitly assume); insofar as there are differences from humanity they will perforce include actual physical/magical differences between humans and goblins not just "they're short, nasty guys with pointy ears who can pick pockets." [The goblins in the Laurell Hamilton's Merrie Gentry novels come to mind] So, for example, goblins consider corruption to be a virtue within goblin society. If your goblin character lives only there, then striving against "vice" would be resisting the urge to be honest. If your goblin character goes into the human world then you can get the effect you want: "But corruption is natural, I should be corrupt, the more corrupt the better...oh wait, you humans don't do what comes natural, I must deliberately avoid doing what comes natural, practice what you humans call "virtue" and be honest." There then has to be a payoff to the character, maybe getting the respect and trust of the humans, and put in a position to acquire other tangible rewards (E.g. "What a grand fellow that goblin is, can see he strives to be virtuous, instead of stealing from the petty cash drawer he's honest, well we want him on our expedition where if we succeed we'll all split great fortunes of loot").

Perhaps I'm wrong (feel free

Perhaps I'm wrong (feel free to stop reading here) but the game issue seems to relate more to freewill than moral code necessarily. The more use of vice, for whatever species, the less control the player retains over the character and in turn the stronger that vice is when used in rolls. I'd assume at some point the character is turned completely to the vice and becomes powerless to resist even against friends? I wouldn't think a moral absolutism is necessarily required, just resisting the particular urges of a species.

You got it in one, vxdxrx.

You got it in one, vxdxrx. Goblins consider their vice to be a virtue because they're governed by that vice. A goblin who recognizes that what goblins consider to be a virtue isn't can then start the process of becoming a person instead of a monster. Most people in a goblin society would be ruled by that vice since it's practiced so regularly, hence they're monsters. Anyway, there are benefits to be gained from acting virtuously, which I'll explain in my next blog entry which deals with the actual system. Thanks for the feedback!